I think I'm about done with vb

[imported_glorify]

Been a long time user of vb--as you can see even by my join date here.

I installed a vb 4 testboard to style so that when I went live with 4, I could just import the style.

I have to say, I have never had to fix so much default template stuff on an unhacked board.

Styling has been a nightmare and I'm pretty competent when it comes to designing my styles.

I downloaded Firebug and am using vb's outdated/missing stylvars pdf. Nothing more frustrating in all the years I have run a site than just trying to find a spot to edit a color. Some color/fonts/etc are hardcoded and some are in stylevars, but there is no logical reason anything is put anywhere.

If you keep a fairly generic white background, it is fairly easy to style. Changing to anything else is just way too time consuming and frustrating.

Just had to *****, and I don't know why I did here, but Kev, I hope you decide to port v3arcade to IPB.

[hornstar85]

we all feel the same currently. I hold my breath that a future release will finally be good enough to install, until then, I only play around with it on my small site and won't touch it on my big board.

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[Detomah]

I definately feel and share your frustrations. With every week and every new bug fix patch, they spit out for vb4, the more it helps me decide that vb3.x.x will be my last upgrades for my site. I see no reason at all to update my forums software any more now, except for security purposes, I have everything the way I like it, the only real pressure to update to newer versions is now coming from the dev community and even then the only reason a lot of devs are upgrading is down to consumer demand. It's a vicious, vicious circle...

[bass.exe21]

And to make matter worse, they are still messing around with stuff that will break the style. :( Its still a better idea to just stick with 3.8.x for now and just wait for 4.1.x. Hopefully, they will have straighten up their act by then.

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[chewbacca]

Things (in terms of styling) have always been bad, but they've gotten worse with vB4. I've avoided using stylevars as much as possible since vB3, actually. I guess that has eased my templating transition a little bit.

I also hate how an old YUI is basically required now. It's more work breaking free from the default JS than CSS. :(

[Biker_GA]

And to make matter worse, they are still messing around with stuff that will break the style.

I think that's one of the things that cheeses me the most. It's holding up a lot of things on the site that I want to get done.

[TheNakedMan]

I'm very happy with vBulletin 3.8.x series.

I won't upgrade to 4.x. It just isn't worth it. I should be able to play with 3.8.x for 2+ years. From there I should be able to upgrade.

They have stripped too many of the 3.8.x features such as blogs, customizations and such for me to upgrade.

[imported_Zachery]

Were many of you around during the v3 alpha beta days? The style was a nightmare then. I know we're working on making the style stuff better moving forward.

Its v2 to v3 all voer again :)

[imported_Mark.B]

Were many of you around during the v3 alpha beta days? The style was a nightmare then. I know we're working on making the style stuff better moving forward.

Its v2 to v3 all voer again :)
I agree, but the difference then was, the product remained in beta until it was all sorted.

We're supposed to have vB4 in Gold now but it's not at that standard.

It looks as though 4.0 will be effectively a beta and 4.1 might hopefully be a genuine Gold version. I am certainly treating it that way, there's no chance 4.0 could go on my live site without a riot ensuing.

[imported_Zachery]

What is so awful it would cause that? I'm curious?

[imported_Mark.B]

What is so awful it would cause that? I'm curious?
There's all sorts of things.

Styling - it's almost impossible to tweak the style effectively because the stylevar system is incomplete, and worse than that, it changes with every release and breaks everything you've set up.

CMS - 200 queries and numerous bugs that make it very difficult to do what you want with it.

Search - a major problem. You can't get individual post results any more, it only shows results as threads. that alone would break my site. Plus, searching on actual words is very hit and miss.

There are lots of things, many very minor but enough in aggregation to make upgrading a definite "no" for larger sites like mine.

I'm hoping 4.1 will sort most of these out, I'm not one of those who wants to jump to Invision or whatever, but 4.0 is just not finished. It's not a "bad product", it just needs finishing, and then it'll be good.

[imported_Zachery]

Styling - it's almost impossible to tweak the style effectively because the stylevar system is incomplete, and worse than that, it changes with every release and breaks everything you've set up. Its not that impossible to tweak the style, as with any new system it takes time to get used to. I'm not saying it doesn't have its problems and we are working on them. But close to impossible is far from the truth, I converted one of my styles to v4 for one of my boards. Took a few hours mostly due to the fact some elements don't exsist now and I had to chnage the colors around abit. Is it "harder" to style v4 than v3? Yes, because we use alot more css and the stylevar system didn't get completed. But its the same as v3 being harder to work with than v2. I'm just tired of hearing people give up before they get started.

CMS does not use 200 queries after the caches are built. Infact the average pageload atm is about 50. Yes this is alot, but they're not any more intensive by default than the same 9-13 queries run on the stock vB forum hompage. Query count is not an acturate accessment of preformance.

Search hasn't really changed tbh, I can still search things just fine, and do when people come and say X is broken or I can't find it.

[imported_glorify]

I'm just tired of hearing people give up before they get started.

Myself giving up without giving it a chance is far from the truth. I put in quite a few hours/days on my test board (I happen not to like a white background style). Sure, it can be done. I am just saying there's NO easy way of doing it with the INCOMPLETE Stylvars manual, the upgrades that break the completed work, the hard coded style css, mixed with the stylevars css.

I am NO rookie when it comes to styling. I have won BOTM at both vb.org and .com.

I have done MANY styles for vb and I have patience to learn new, but when things are just built with no rhyme or reason, it's a little too annoying.

I have been with vb for a long time and bought the presale suite. If you think I am happy about flushing that cash down the crapper, spending additional funds for a new forum software, AND losing vbadvanced (which I paid for branding free) and v3arcade (which I also paid for branding free) then you are sadly mistaken. In fact, I'd rather not switch.

Sadly tho, right now it's a race. A race for VB to get it right or IPB to release 3.1. Whichever comes first is the route I am going.

[hornstar85]

I am disappointed that some features are missing too. I don't think I could ever upgrade until the user customizations are back. Many of my loyal members really love making their profiles stand out and to lose that would be a big thing to them.

After reading how long it takes to reindex posts after the upgrade I am a bit unusre my server is up for the task since I am now over 1.3 million posts. I wish the sphinx integration was up and running already for VB4. That would make things heaps better overall.

and as for customizations I have to wait until a 3rd party releases some good ones and I am yet to see any 3rd party skin makers making any good paid ones. That being said I have to wait .....

[imported_Zachery]

Horn, There seem to be mixed results on posts redinexing, some people are showing hours, while others ar days. I think it depends on alot of factors.

[KW802]

Horn, There seem to be mixed results on posts redinexing, some people are showing hours, while others ar days. I think it depends on alot of factors.
Did it ever come up why that 1.2MM hard-coding was in there?

[imported_Zachery]

I didn't ask, I would guess it came up in internal testing.

[imported_glorify]

3.1 beta is live on ipb.com. Fricking ROCKS! I just bought a license today. Officially converting :)

Anyone looking for an extra vb publishing suite license, lemme know.