Is this product Supported at all?

[jcerious]

I've put in several requests for help here on this board and I've PM'd the site owner - but haven't received any response from him. I'm assuming there is no support - even if you make a purchase. A couple of my questions in the forums were answered, but the more difficult ones that I really need help with and I assume only the creator of the software can really answer - haven't been answered. And it has been several days with no answer.

Just curious if this is supported or if you're pretty much on your own after installing.

[Zachery]

Yes, however like Jelsoft does with vBulletin, we only provide support for the original proudct itself, not for addons, modules, modifications, etc.

I generally don't even respond to my pms unless its urgent.

If you have an issue please open a support ticket so myself, Brian, Kevin, or John can help you.

Currently Brian is not avaible as much as he used to be due to some private matters.

[Ohiosweetheart]

Afraid I have to ask the same question. I've been trying to get an answer to a post since the 19th... 10 days.

where do I go to open a support ticket??

[Zachery]

http://www.vbadvanced.com/ticket.php?do=newticket

[jcerious]

I don't understand all this "we don't provide support for modifications"! I mean that's what the product was made for - so you can make modification! I move a module from one column to the other - that's a modification right? I re-set the home page or whatever - everything you do with this is a modification.

It seems that Jelsoft - and all these vB guys try to duck out of giving any support by calling everything you do a "modification"!

It's getting kind of annoying really.

I just had a run-in with a guy at Jelsoft. I wanted to change the menu links in the Nav Bar. He said that was a "modification" so he couldn't tell me how!

For crying out loud! If you look at the code for the navbar it's this vBulletin php code. I'm not sure what all their variables are but I need to change one of them. And he wouldn't even tell me how. He said, "if you don't know html you shouldn't be messing with this anyway"! How rude and arrogant! Unbelievable.

Anyway, on vbadvanced, I've asked several questions that are not about modifications. They're about how do you do things in vbadvanced. Most of my questions have now been answered by other members - which I appreciate. But a couple still haven't been answered and they're still problems.

The other thing is - if you're running a serious web site with this - as I am - and there's some kind of an emergency - like you screw something up and it just stops working and you really need urgent support - it's apparent that that's not available - even if you're willing to pay for it.

So I would caution everybody - if you're using this for a mission critical web site - BE VERY CAREFUL - with any changes you make! Keep frequent and current backups. Always make a backup of your database before you make any changes that potentially could go wrong. BE VERY CAREFUL! Because if the whole thing gets screwed up and you just can't figure out the problem - it could be days - before you would get an answer and could get your web site back up and running.

Honestly, on a product like this - I much rather pay for it and be offered support - than get it for free with no support.

But if the jelsoft example is any guide - you pay for it and then don't really get any decent support.

[Zachery]

Originally Posted by jcerious

I don't understand all this "we don't provide support for modifications"! I mean that's what the product was made for - so you can make modification! I move a module from one column to the other - that's a modification right? I re-set the home page or whatever - everything you do with this is a modification.

There is a difference, we support the code _WE_ wrote. Moving a module around is not a modification, re-writing the templates are. Re-writing php code is, adding new php code is.

Originally Posted by jcerious

It seems that Jelsoft - and all these vB guys try to duck out of giving any support by calling everything you do a "modification"!

It's getting kind of annoying really.

I just had a run-in with a guy at Jelsoft. I wanted to change the menu links in the Nav Bar. He said that was a "modification" so he couldn't tell me how!

For crying out loud! If you look at the code for the navbar it's this vBulletin php code. I'm not sure what all their variables are but I need to change one of them. And he wouldn't even tell me how. He said, "if you don't know html you shouldn't be messing with this anyway"! How rude and arrogant! Unbelievable.

Seeing as I work for Jelsoft as well I'll tell you the same thing Steve(I'm guessing) told you. We do not support third party code, or modifications. I'm sorry you don't like that, but the fact is we are not going to spend 3-5 hours debugging and issue that _isn't_ caused by our code. As far as the navbar template, its mostly html, with some javascript and vbphrases, theres no php in any vBulletin template. And I'd have to say thats a fairly true statment. If you don't understand html, you shouldn't be trying to change it, and there isn't a whole lot stoping you from picking up the basicis. http://www.w3schools.com

Originally Posted by jcerious

Anyway, on vbadvanced, I've asked several questions that are not about modifications. They're about how do you do things in vbadvanced. Most of my questions have now been answered by other members - which I appreciate. But a couple still haven't been answered and they're still problems.

Can you point me to witch?

Originally Posted by jcerious

The other thing is - if you're running a serious web site with this - as I am - and there's some kind of an emergency - like you screw something up and it just stops working and you really need urgent support - it's apparent that that's not available - even if you're willing to pay for it.

So I would caution everybody - if you're using this for a mission critical web site - BE VERY CAREFUL - with any changes you make! Keep frequent and current backups. Always make a backup of your database before you make any changes that potentially could go wrong. BE VERY CAREFUL! Because if the whole thing gets screwed up and you just can't figure out the problem - it could be days - before you would get an answer and could get your web site back up and running.

Backsups, Backups, Backups, If you are willing to play with a production site and messup, thats not something we can be held accountable for. You should _NEVER_ be doing any live modifications on a mission critial website, thats why vB allows you a testbed for modifications

Originally Posted by jcerious

Honestly, on a product like this - I much rather pay for it and be offered support - than get it for free with no support.

But if the jelsoft example is any guide - you pay for it and then don't really get any decent support.

I am insulted by this, I've dedicated thousands of hours of support, and I'd have to say 95% of all customers I've ever delt with were satisifed. I'm sorry that you are not. I think you are expecting us to hold your hand, and fix the problems you cause because you started changing and modifing the default code. We don't do that, and never have. Altho we generally do go though as much of the checklist as possible to avoid people having to uninstall their hacks/addons/whatnot, however if its not happening in a default install. Chances are its their hack or addon causing the issue.

[jcerious]

Geesh man - I've really had it with all this attitude from you guys! Who's the customer (the paying customer I might add), here anyway?

I've had a web hosting company for over 10 years with thousands of customers. I've had some really stupid customers. But I have NEVER talked to them or allowed my staff to talk to them like you guys do.

We have one fundamental rule. Never call the customer stupid and never treat them as if they're stupid. You guys break that rule all the time.

Second you're making a LOT of WRONG assumptions about my support requests.

One request to Jelsoft was to simply tell me if I could take out the vb code that linked to the FAQ page and simply replace it with a URL that went direct to a page I wanted to link to. Their response was basically that if I didn't know anything about html I shouldn't be trying this in the first place.

WHAT A RUDE AND UN-CALLED FOR RESPONSE! A better response would have been "sure, you can replace the vb phrases with a URL", or "no, you can't do that". THAT'S ALL I wanted to know and I'm met with incredible attitude - as I must say I am getting from you as well! HOW ANNOYING YOU PEOPLE ARE.

I too have dedicated thousands of hours to customer support and I NEVER treat my customers the way you guys do... not even the really annoying ones.

And I don't apprecaite your assuming that all of my problems have been caused by customizations and hacks that I've done to your product. I haven't done any customization or hacks!

Look, here's a simple question that never got answered. I turned collapsable menus off one day to see what the site would look like without them. Then I turned them back on - but they never appeared again on the site. That's not a "customization" or "hack" is it!? It' just using the controls in the program.

Another question concerned my inability to create a new news.php based module. I went to Add Module and tried to create one - but it somehow got intermingled with the existing news module.

Another question which I haven't asked yet but will now, is some changes show up on the home page when you edit them in Edit Modules and others don't. Some you have to make the change in Edit Pages - instead of edit modules. There seems to be no rhyme or reason. For instance, if I want to select threads to appear in the Thread module - it seems I have to do this from Edit Modules. If I do it from Edit Pages - I get all kinds of database errors and it won't make the change. But if I go back to Edit Modules and do it, it works fine.

Other things I have to edit on Edit Pages - not Edit Modules. So it's very confusing.

Now, are those questions I'm not supposed to ask? Are those problems I have caused? And you simply won't support them because they're my fault!? Am I just asking for "hand-holding" or am I asking for a few clues on how to use a new and unfamiliar product? Aren't those the types of things new customers are expected to ask?

I'd really appreciate a little less attitude and a little more professionalism. If you can't answer the question simply say so. But you don't have to insult me at the same time.

I don't know why you would be insulted that I would suggest that I would like to PAY you for support! I don't think people should work for free. And I like to pay people who do work for me. Why is that insulting?

And by the way - I have NEVER even looked at the default code - much less changed it. The ONLY changes I've ever made were from the program admin cp interface.

[Zachery]

Second you're making a LOT of WRONG assumptions about my support requests.

One request to Jelsoft was to simply tell me if I could take out the vb code that linked to the FAQ page and simply replace it with a URL that went direct to a page I wanted to link to. Their response was basically that if I didn't know anything about html I shouldn't be trying this in the first place.

WHAT A RUDE AND UN-CALLED FOR RESPONSE! A better response would have been "sure, you can replace the vb phrases with a URL", or "no, you can't do that". THAT'S ALL I wanted to know and I'm met with incredible attitude - as I must say I am getting from you as well! HOW ANNOYING YOU PEOPLE ARE.

I want to see this post, or ticket, if you have a ticket id please share it with me, if its on the forums please provide a link.

Look, here's a simple question that never got answered. I turned collapsable menus off one day to see what the site would look like without them. Then I turned them back on - but they never appeared again on the site. That's not a "customization" or "hack" is it!? It' just using the controls in the program.

I responded to your post, and I am waiting a followup.

Another question which I haven't asked yet but will now, is some changes show up on the home page when you edit them in Edit Modules and others don't. Some you have to make the change in Edit Pages - instead of edit modules. There seems to be no rhyme or reason. For instance, if I want to select threads to appear in the Thread module - it seems I have to do this from Edit Modules. If I do it from Edit Pages - I get all kinds of database errors and it won't make the change. But if I go back to Edit Modules and do it, it works fine.

Modules have master settings, however each page also has its own set of modules, and moduel settings, so if you edit the pages module, it pulls from there.



Now, I am sorry that we are getting into a heated debate, and I do truely wish to resolve the issues we are having. I'm also sorry if I came off so rudely, I was trying to make a point of what we do, and why we do it, not that you nessarlily are doing said things.

If you continue to work with me, I will cotninue to work with you, I'm fairly certin that I've responded to all of your posts on the forums, if not please bump them.

[KW802]

Just a reminder to everybody/anybody reading this thread:

Please note that vBadvanced is a privately owned and operated company and that we are in no way affiliated with Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd, nor will Jelsoft be able to provide any support for our products.

[jcerious]

Zachey, thank you for your response. You seem like a good guy and I don't want to get into a heated debate either! I might suggest however, that you look at what you to me in post #6 in this thread:

"I think you are expecting us to hold your hand, and fix the problems you cause because you started changing and modifing the default code."

Your use of the word "you" there made it sound like you were assuming that I was doing all of those things. I think it would have been better if you had asked me if I had done any of those things and then if I responded in the affirmative you could have told me that you don't support those kinds of changes.

The first thing I do with my clients when I need to tell them something like that is I completely drop the word "YOU" so they won't think I'm referring to them specifically.

Anyway, just a suggestion. Thanks for your clarification that that's not what you meant.

I did see your response on the collapsable menus just awhile ago and haven't respond yet. I will respond there though - to keep this thread from going off in the wrong direction.

The response from Jelsoft was by email - I'm not sure I have a link to it, anyway, I'll send it to you - sometime today or tomorrow when I have a chance to look for it. But this guy was totally out of control! I actually got the feeling he was overly worked and tired or I actually even began thinking he might be drunk!

At one point he said:
"As I said if you knew HTML you would know what to do with this:

<td class="vbmenu_control"><a href="faq.php$session[sessionurl_q]" accesskey="5">$vbphrase[faq]</a></td>

And if you don't then honestly you really shouldn't be messing with it.

This is an HTML <a href> link:

"faq.php$session[sessionurl_q]"

That's so insulting "if you knew html". He doesn't know whether I know html or not. And the fact is I do know enough to know that. But I don't know much about vbphrases and I don't know if it's okay to replace a vbphrase with straight html or not! I was just asking for a little guidance and he had to get all snippy about it.

In response to my question for guidance on how to customize the links on the navbar he said:

"The bottom line is that it is not our job to customozie your forums for you."

I wasn't asking for him to customize anything for me. I was asking for enough of an explanation of the proprietary vb code so I could customize it myself!

It finally got so heated I told him I did not want to deal with him anymore and he responded by saying:

"I wish I could take back the 8 support tickets I did handle for you."

I would never allow one of my people to talk that way to one of our customers no matter how heated it had gotten. That's so unprofessional.

Thanks...

[Zachery]

Go ahead and pm it to me. Or if you tell me the email address you used I will take a look.

[southbendforum]

What about adding an FAQ for problems. Im still searching on how to solve the fact that my navbar on this wont work on the CMPS. Searching for "navbar links" is making me search through 17 pages of posts on how to fix, with most unanswered, or not helpful. Frustration is mounting for this 'free download'.

[Zachery]

Did you try reading the FAQ that comes with the product itself? Please start your own thread on the issue and someone will tend to it.

IT doesn't help when you delete your support threads.